Nicole Doucet | CEO and Co-founder, Open Water | Making bottled water go circular

This week’s guest thinks plastic water bottles should be history. Nicole Doucet is the CEO and Co-Founder of Open Water, a bottled water company that uses aluminum packaging as a more sustainable alternative to single-use plastic bottles. Ten years ago, while still in university and after watching a documentary on plastic pollution, Nicole and her Co-Founder, Jess Page, were inspired to disrupt the bottled water industry with an approach that puts circularity at the forefront. As we continue to face the climate crisis and its very real impact, Nicole and her partner are raising awareness on pollution caused by single-use plastic bottled water — which is, unfortunately, still the industry standard, with the world’s leading consumer goods companies continuing to sell water bottled in harmful plastic.

Listen to this episode to find out how Nicole set out to create Open Water to offer a more environmentally and health-friendly solution for drinking water.

This season of The Brand is Female is brought to you by TD Bank - Women Entrepreneurs. TD is proud to support women entrepreneurs and help them achieve success and growth through its program of educational workshops, financing and mentorship opportunities! Find out how you can benefit from their support!

Full Episode Transcript

Eva Hartling: I'm Eva Hartling, welcome to The Brand is Female. Where every week I speak with women change-makers who are redefining the rules of female leadership. This season of our podcast is brought to you by TD bank group women entrepreneurs. TD helps women in business achieve success and growth through its program of educational workshops, financing and mentorship.

Visit The Brand is Female dot com slash podcast. And follow the link to find out how TD can help this week. My guest is Nicole Doucet, CEO and co-founder of open water, a bottled water company that uses aluminum packaging as a more sustainable alternative to single-use plastic bottles 10 years ago, while still in university, Nicole and her co-founder Jess page were inspired to disrupt a bottled water industry with an approach that allows for circularity after watching a documentary about plastic pollution, as we continue to face a climate crisis.

And its very real impact, Nicole and her partner are raising awareness on pollution caused by single-use plastic bottled water, which is the industry standard today. Unfortunately, the world's leading consumer goods companies, still selling water bottled in harmful plastic. Find out how Nicole set out to create open water to offer a more environmentally friendly solution for drinking water.

Here is our conversation,

Nicole, it's a pleasure welcoming you on The Brand is Female today thank you so much for making time to chat.

Nicole Doucet: Thank you so much for having me. I'm very happy to be here.

Eva Hartling: Pleasure. And I like to start these conversations by going back in time a little bit. And I'd like to ask you growing up. Did you imagine you'd have the type of career you have today?

Do you imagine you'd started your own business or were you dreaming of doing something completely different perhaps?

Nicole Doucet: Yeah. So when I was very young soccer was really my passion and that was what I thought I would be a professional soccer player when I grew up. But there was always a part of me that has been drawn to businesses and to entrepreneurship.

My dad is an entrepreneur. He started his own company. That's what I've seen in my whole life. So yeah, I think. Very young. I imagining something completely different, but then as I started growing I think this started being a path that I could see for myself. Although I didn't think that I would undertake this from the start of my career.

Eva Hartling: That's so interesting. And speaking of which I think Canada just won the women's soccer Olympics.

Nicole Doucet: Congratulations. That's amazing. Thank you. Grew up in Mexico and in Mexico, it's interesting because women's soccer is really not a thing. It's a sport that has been reserved for men for a very long time.

And when I played, when I was a kid, I played with boys my entire life, basically. But it's great to see. It's great to see. More and more countries with like strong soccer teams, because I think it encourages a little girls who might see themselves in those players. Absolutely.

Eva Hartling: Yeah. So interesting that you grew up in Mexico, and I wonder if that informed your path a little bit.

And my next question was going to be obviously, your business open water. You serve a very specific purpose by providing water, but you also help address an important environmental concern. And I'm curious to know when the seed was planted, for you. Was that something that was always on your mind, were you looking to tackle a specific project?

Or how did it all start for you basically? And I know you have a business partner

Nicole Doucet: as well, for sure. Yeah. I think that the whole plastic pollution issue has been something that I have personally seen and yes, growing up in Mexico did play a role in that. We used to go to the beach as kids with my parents and then growing up, seeing those same beaches.

Pristine and beautiful. When we were younger, slowly start getting invaded by, trash, a lot of plastic caps, plastic bottles, et cetera. I think has been on my mind for a long time, but really the turning point for me was when I was in college, I went to the University of Miami in the US and I met my co-founder there.

We actually played soccer together. And yeah, and so we happened to walk into a documentary that they were playing on campus about plastic pollution. It just it blew my mind because I had seen the problem myself, but I didn't really know the scale. Seeing a few pieces of plastic and a beach here and there doesn't really reflect how big the problem is.

And we walked out of the theatre thinking, obviously bottled water plays a role in this problem. Why does it even exist? Why does this product exist? There's this perfectly sustainable solution already out there, which is reusable bottles, tap water fountains, you can find them everywhere.

And yet, if you look at the bottled water industry, it continues to grow and grow. And so why do we keep using this product that we maybe, use in a few minutes and then dispose of and it's creating this entire issue for our oceans And we realized that we started talking to our friends and started thinking about our own consumption habits too.

And we realized that every single one of us owns somewhere between six and 12 reusable bottles because we get them at like at conferences. And like basically everywhere you go, you get a reasonable bottle. And we keep all of them in a kitchen cabinet somewhere except the one. And there's one, that's her favourite.

It's the one that we actually use that we take with us but even people who really care about this issue who really make an effort to use a reusable bottle, sometimes we find ourselves without it. Sometimes we find ourselves travelling or at a concert, or maybe you didn't want to carry it around with you all day, or you forgot it.

Or, even people who really care, still buy bottled water. And we thought, okay, There's a perfect solution that already exists from a sustainability standpoint, but that solution isn't really taken into account how we work as humans and what we need to do. If we want to make an impact is come up with something more pragmatic, something that is not going to ask people to change their habits, but rather give them a more sustainable alternative for when they find themselves without the reusable.

Eva Hartling: And that's a brilliant idea. And actually, I have a really silly anecdote. That's probably my favourite kind of reusable water bottle Story. I was travelling to Panama with a girlfriend and we were in a remote village by the ocean. So not in Panama city, not near major major town. And we were staying at this little surf shack and she's somebody who has been very diligent about using, reusable bottles and being very mindful of them.

The little gestures we can make in our every day have an impact. So she kept filling up her bottle everywhere. We went and the same thing, just a little surf shack. She would fill up her bottle at the faucet. Except for a few days later, she got a major case of food poisoning. She had ingested bacteria because the water was not drinkable.

And she assumed it was safe, but it was not. But the only other option, in, in our room was these little plastic bottles of water and she didn't want to use the plastics. Anyway, we still have a long ways to go, but you're helping address part of the problem. I'm curious to know, this could have been just an idea and you could have not turned it into an actual business.

So I am curious to know, kind of where your entrepreneurial spirit might come from, did you have role models around you? You mentioned I think your dad is an entrepreneur. So was it the next obvious move for you to make a business out of this?

Nicole Doucet: I don't think it's ever an obvious move.

I think it's a hard thing to start a business. But at that point, we had come up with the idea and the idea was because we talked about the problem and why reusable bottles, aren't meeting the needs of most consumers. The idea for us was to reduce the impact of the packaging as much as possible.

And that's how we came up with aluminum cancer, actually the most recycled beverage packaging in the world. But basically what happened is that at that point, I was like, this is it like, this is something that really speaks to me, to the things that I care about. It's going, if I can make it happen, it's going to allow me to have a purpose and make a difference.

And I think I was also lucky enough that this idea came to me at a point in my life where. You know I didn't have any responsibilities. I was in college. It's, I think exactly, it becomes very hard. Sometimes I think for people as they go into their careers and they start progressing in their careers, it's very hard to give that up.

And you have a family and you're in a different point of your life where the risk seems so much bigger. And for me, because it was so early in my life I felt look, I, we can try this out. And if it doesn't work, I'll just, I'll get a job like everyone else. And I didn't feel like there was a lot to lose and it was something that I was very passionate about.

And my parents always encouraged me. So yes, my dad was an entrepreneur. My mum was a stay-at-home mom while we were kids. But after we became independent, she was, I think, getting bored out of her mind too. And she started her own business as well. And so it is something that I've been surrounded with growing up and that encouragement from them, I think, was like the little push that I needed to actually say, okay, I'm going to try that.

Eva Hartling: That makes sense. And so when you decided to launch your own company, how was the concept perceived and knowing that you obviously have to, I think you, you focus on selling to a third party. Since most people purchase their bottles of water from a store basically, and rarely from the distributor directly.

And knowing that, it's giant corporations that kind of have the monopoly on water bottles and what a bottle distribution. So what was that process like?

Nicole Doucet: Yeah. So at the beginning so first the, I think the first step that we had to make for us as we needed some money because this isn't a company that you can.

Lunch from your house and see how it goes. And you can't fill these bottles from your faucet and then start selling them and see how people respond. So we needed to meet certain production minimums. We needed to find a manufacturing partner that was able to work with us. And so we needed some capital to get started and a lot of people that we talked to them.

You guys are insane. This is, this doesn't make any sense. They didn't really understand the problem with plastics. First of all, wasn't top of mind for most people, this was back in 2010. And then to your point, this industry is dominated by the big players. You're talking about Coke. You're talking about Pepsi, you're talking about Nestle, how do you even compete there?

But anyway we were able to convince a few people to give us some money and to try this out. And then we ran into a whole bunch of production issues because we were the first ones. So we were the first ones. Water in a reclosable aluminum bottle, but we were also the first ones to put a non-carbonated drink into a reclosable aluminum ball.

And so the production process that existed wasn't really fit to what we wanted it to do. And it took us a long time to get things figured out. And then when we finally launched their reception was I think it was very polarized. I would say some people immediately. Some people were like, okay. Yes, I know this problem.

I understand it. I understand why aluminum is better. I understand that it gets recycled more often than it gets recycled more efficiently and then some other people were just like water in a can like this. Why would you ever buy that? And then why am I going to pay more for it? Because the container itself is a little bit more expensive.

So I would say at the beginning, We really had to find. As you said we sell mostly to other businesses. We do sell directly to consumers on our website, but most of the volume that we do is sold through businesses. So we work with them, I think the one that most people think of is grocery stores.

But we also work with hotels and attractions and restaurants and what we have to do at the beginning. Really try to find businesses that cared about sustainability that really care, right? Because a lot of businesses and nowadays, almost every business says that they care says that they're making efforts to become more sustainable.

There are only a few that actually, it's actually part of their core values. And so we started finding those businesses and that allowed us to get some traction back when people were really not talking about plastics. And then as time has gone on that conversation has changed.

Because now, there's been so much coverage on, plastic pollution. What effects it's having on our environment, what effects is having on our All of that has become part of the mainstream conversation and that has changed things for us, for sure.

Eva Hartling: has it been difficult operating, running a business, that's you're largely purpose-driven.

You're also commercially viable, but the bottles, I know an aluminum can is more expensive than plastic bottles. You have to charge more and I'm sure your process is also cumbersome. Have there been instances where, you had to rethink a direction or pivot part of your concept because it was hard to meet that objective of, staying true to your purpose and your values, but then still needing to the reality of a commercial business,

Nicole Doucet: basically.

Yeah. That's a great question. And I think it's a question. Most founders who have a sense of purpose for their business, run into because there's always a balance between how sustainable you are and how viable your businesses are because you can always do more things to be more sustainable, but there's a point where the market will not bear a cost of that.

And so I think it's always a balancing act. For us, the sustainability part has been our core value. That really has been, that's why we exist. And that's why people purchase our products. We don't want to dilute that because that's really what we think we can offer that others cannot.

But to your point, I think that. Having a product that is accessible is incredibly important. And one of the things that we did is, so, at the beginning, we launched with an aluminum bottle that has a twist-off cap and that container is very expensive to produce. And although we are competitive with anything on the premium side.

So if you think of, Fiji or Evian or boss, anything like that, we are competitive. But it was very hard for us to compete with some of them, the cheaper plastic bottles. We decided to do is we launched a 12-ounce standard can back in 2018. And that's just like a soda can, but filled with water.

And it's a package that is way cheaper to make than the bottles that we have. And that allowed us to reach a completely different set of. Businesses and consumers really cared about sustainability but couldn't afford the price point of the bottle.

Eva Hartling: This season of The Brand is Female is made possible with the support of TD bank group, women entrepreneurs, confidently building your business, takes sound advice, plus guidance to the right connections, tools, and resources.

As a woman, entrepreneur myself, I know I need all the support I can get. What's great about TD services for women in business is their collaboration-based approach. They work with both internal and external partners who can provide education, financing and mentorship and community support. TD employees are able to be proactive in the advice and guidance they give to women's businesses.

They can facilitate and connect you to workshops, coaching and mentorship and they engage other like-minded business leaders in an authentic way. So we can share experiences and learn from each other. Speaking of, kind of pivots and changes and marketing. I know you also launched at a company with a different name at first, and I thought the anecdote was interesting.

So I think it was called green sheep when you first launched. That's right. I'm so curious to know what happened with the sheep, terrible

Nicole Doucet: idea. Really we when my co-founder and I were starting to come up with names, we were like, okay, we want to be really different. Because we don't want to be part of this industry.

We're trying to go against the current here. We need a name that reflects that. And we were like, okay. We're like the black. But in a greenway, and that's where the name came from. But obviously, there was a complete breakdown in terms of that thought process that I just described and what consumers thought about.

They saw our product and when we first launched people would always come up to us and they would be like what is this are you guys doing anything with sheep? It was just like this additional obstacle that we had put up on ourselves so that we really didn't need to have. And we realized pretty quickly that, we have made a mistake there.

And so we, decided, to rebrand to open water and it took a while to do the rebrand because also we were so small at that point that we had to run through the green sheep inventory that we had made. So even if we wanted the team, we just but it's been a great change,

it's one of those lessons that really stick with you. You can get so close to these things. Sometimes you've worked on them for so long. Going from idea to actual product takes a long time, and sometimes you're so close to the product that you forget to step back and think about how are people actually going to see this,

what are other people going to think about this?

Eva Hartling: Yeah, that's a great lesson. And I went through that myself or my own business used to be called something and end a podcast is to be called something completely different. Went through that and it's good when you can when that can happen early on, it's an easier process when it's, when your company is still young, as opposed to having to do a full rebranding many years later,

Nicole Doucet: for sure. And I think that one of the considerations for us was even though we were. We had customers and we were like some people have seen our brand, like we're going to lose those people.

And I think there's, there is definitely an adjustment. It would be so much more painful to have to go through that now

Eva Hartling: and speaking of these lessons and these moments that as entrepreneurs we, we learn from and have to live through really. Are there things that you wish you knew before you launched your business, that you found out the hard way apart from having to change?

Nicole Doucet: We've made a ton of mistakes. We came into this industry with no previous experience in the beverage and I would say it's a double-edged sword because you come in with little experience. Sometimes you don't know how things work. You don't know who the right person to reach out to.

You don't know how distributors work, what their margins are. All of these things are new to you. And obviously, I wish we had known all those things before because it would have made it this like the learning curve so much shorter, but at the same time, coming into an industry where you have no experience gives you this fresh perspective.

You're not really looking to fit into a mould. You don't know how things are done, so you forge your own path. And one of the things that we did because of that is most of the food and beverage companies that start out, have to work very hard to build their distribution.

And that means you're selling your product to a distributor and the distributor then has all the retail customers that they sell. And that process can be very long because the distributors don't want to take your product in unless they have customers to sell it to. And the retailers that you talked to, if you talk to them directly, They don't want them, even if they want to order your product, they can't because of this grocer doesn't carry it.

So there's this yeah, there's this chicken and egg problem. And it takes brands a long time, to build that distribution and to gain nationwide distribution because they have to solve this on regional basis geography by geography. And when we ran into that problem, we started seeing, okay, there are people who want our product, but they can't get it because we don't have the distribution.

We started shipping directly to businesses. So we started finding businesses that would go through a higher volume of water. And we started shipping directly to them and that allowed us to build distribution before having the distributors on. And then we started getting a presence in some geographic areas without the distributors.

And the distributors started noticing, they were like, oh, this, this water, I've seen it at, 10 hotels Just in the past month or something like that. He started noticing. And so we started being able to then build the relationship with the distributors to service even more customers from there.

Eva Hartling: That makes sense. And that was clearly a good move. If you had to give advice to someone and possibly a young woman looking to start a business, maybe that is very much purpose-driven and maybe even tackling an environmental issue like yours, what would be your top advice?

Nicole Doucet: That's a hard question. I think and advise, and this is something that I feel pretty strongly about for any business, not just purpose-driven businesses. Having a co-founder is like, it's one of the best things. It really is because this path is, it's not easy. I think people talk about entrepreneurship in, a very positive

Eva Hartling: way.

Yeah. They make it look really glamorous and fun and sexy.

Nicole Doucet: Yes. And we forget sometimes to talk about how hard it can be. And going through that process. I can imagine would be extremely draining emotionally. And having someone who is going to go through those ups and downs with you is extremely valuable.

I feel like I've been incredibly lucky to have someone as a co-founder. I get along very well. We work with each other very well, but we also have been able to get through each other through these rough spots that, happen and they will continue to happen. And having that support there, I think, is essential.

At least for me, it's something that I want to start a company without a co-founder that's is going through the same thing.

Eva Hartling: yeah, that's good advice. And speaking of, being two women at the helm and also because you started with no prior experience and it's not like you had an established career either, you were still in school when you came up with the idea.

So was it hard? Kind of establishing your reputation and being taken seriously as you went to potential suppliers and clients, and that whole process even, partners for financing or.

Nicole Doucet: It was so hard. And I don't know if your viewers have access to the recording, the visual recording, but I look very young.

And in addition to being a woman, I'm also very small, I look very young and I think oftentimes when. When I went to talk to suppliers or partners or to potential customers, people would be like, who is this little girl? And it was hard to get taken seriously. There were times for example when When we had our first launch, we had an intern that came in to help us with sales.

And he was amazing. He was great at his job. And we would often go to meetings together. And the second we opened the door, the entire conversation was directed to him. Always like everything like all the customers just immediately thought, he's the person that's going to be making the decision.

He's the boss. So it's definitely a challenge. But I think it also, it can wait, it can work to your advantage sometimes when people underestimate you. And we've learned to become more assertive. I think that's something that women have a hard time doing. It's something that I still have a hard time doing.

But I think as you go through these experiences and you realize. You also need to change and you also need to make sure that you are taking it seriously. It's not all on the other party. There is some responsibility on you as well. And there are some things that you can do to be more assertive, to be more confident.

Eva Hartling: love that story of, you looking even younger than your actual age, and everybody would turn to the intern. I've been in that situation, whoever the man was in the room. They would assume that he was in charge, even if it's the intern or, a junior on your team..

For sure. A classic situation. Yeah. And, hopefully, it is changing slowly but surely. And actually, as a segue to that, what does leadership mean to you and as a woman leading your team, what are some traits or behaviours or qualities that you think you bring to your leadership?

Nicole Doucet: That's a very good question. The first one is the first part is I guess, very philosophical, right? What does leadership mean? For me, it's always been, I think about setting an example. I think that oftentimes or at least the leaders that resonate with me are the ones who are setting an example.

It's not about, it's not about power. It's not about. You have to do this. It's not about people who are extremely strong and kind of dictator- Like. For me, the best leaders are the ones. Yeah. Are leading by example. Yeah, I think that's what it means to me. And I think that's something that we've tried to maintain as our business has grown and as we've hired people, both my co-founder and I are very hands-on.

No task is below us. If we are available, if we are the people who are there and able to do something, then we do it. It happens from time to time that I don't know. Needs a few cases for an event, then they're going to come by the office and pick them up. If I'm the one that's available, I will be the one to drive to the office and get the cases and help the person load them into the car.

And I think that we've tried to maintain that in our team, that kind of make yourself available. We're all part of this together. And obviously we each have, our jobs and we each have the things that we focus on, but I think that mentality is very strong in our team.

Eva Hartling: That's great to hear and I'm sure your team appreciates it.

Nicole Doucet: We've

Eva Hartling: We're. We're talking about a Fort wave now, but we've been living through, I think what is now like over 20 months of a pandemic. I was actually speaking to a woman entrepreneur who's in a similar product category making bitters for cocktails, they've mentioned a shortage of aluminum can that's been going on across the world. Really. And obviously, COVID has impacted anyone that is dealing with consumers, with supply chains, with the hospitality industry quite specifically. So I wonder what that has been like for you and what are the main challenges that you're still struggling with as a result, but also what is

your path forward as we hopefully move out of the pandemic.

Nicole Doucet: Mic. Yeah, for sure. Yes, the pandemic hit us very hard because 90% of our business was basically based on what we call on-premise accounts. So these are places where the product is sold and consumed in the same place.

So you're talking about a lot of hospitality hotels, restaurants college campuses, attractions, basically, everything that closed, those were our customers. And April 2020 was extremely hard. We went from having a company that was growing extremely quickly to all of a sudden, seeing a huge drop in revenues.

So we had a few rough months we started focusing a lot during those months we started focusing a lot on revamping our e-commerce rethinking about our website. So focusing more on the direct to consumer side and also starting to think about retail because we have up until that point, we really had stayed away from your typical grocery store.

Your convenience stores, all of that. We have gone directly onto the food service or on-premise side. And at that point we said, okay, we thought we had a very diversified business, but it turns out we don't. And so now we need to find other channels for our product. And so we started doing that.

And then as things started reopening over the summer of 2020 things started reopening and we saw a lot of our foodservice customers come back. And then since then, it's been, it's slowly improved over winter 2020. And then in 2022, when, I mean in 2021, I'm skipping a year in tiny one things just started taking off again, as soon as things reopened, we've seen a huge increase in demand.

And I think that it has to do with the fact that the pandemic kind of reminded us. What our role is as humans in this planet. And it's been interesting because I think that a part of me thought, we just went through this pandemic. The hospitality industry suffered greatly and continues to have a hard time, switching from a product that is very cheap to one that is not as cheap is going to be the last thing on there.

And it turns out that I was completely wrong. Sustainability is continuously becoming more and more important. And so we've seen a huge growth in the past three months. And hopefully, things continue moving in this direction.

Eva Hartling: That's amazing. I'm glad to hear that. And it's so interesting because in speaking to women entrepreneurs across different categories, I think, and all include, the type of work that we do because we work with women change-makers and our clients are typically purpose-driven companies.

We've noticed that rise in global consciousness. And it's so much of the world's inequity was put under a spotlight during COVID that people are realizing they need to act as citizens and take responsibility. So it's interesting that it's being applied in your case as well.

And it makes sense and hopefully continues. And we see it as lasting change, not just as a trend post-COVID. And then the last question I have for you, which is my favourite is what do you wish women would do less of?

Nicole Doucet: Oh, wow. That's a good one. I wish we were less polite. I still, feel sometimes we are, we have been thoughts since we were kids that being polite, is a number one thing you should aim for.

And sometimes that politeness gets in the way of getting respect. And sometimes we fail to actually speak our minds because we want to be liked because we want to not seem rude. And I think that we do that a lot more than men do and that there is nothing wrong with sometimes saying how you actually feel.

And I know that we continue to do this. People do perceive us differently when we are not polite, but I wish that we all stopped being so focused on. On being perceived in that way. And I think it's something that we struggle with. I know it's something that I struggle with. And I hope that we can start changing little by little that

Eva Hartling: I, I love that answer and it kinda, it connects with something you brought up earlier, as well as, working on being more assertive.

And that is very good. Because, yes we do tend to do that as women I'm guilty of that myself. It's hard. It is you're right. But it's, we can put in practice day after day and find what, what feels right to us because yeah it's a change when we start doing it. Yeah. Thank you for sharing all of your journey and your advice and wishing you the best with Open Water, excited to see what happens next with the company.

And thanks so much for coming on today.

Nicole Doucet: Thank you so much for having me. I really enjoyed the conversation.

Eva Hartling: I really hope you enjoyed today's conversation. And if you did, as always, don't forget to subscribe, rate and give us a review wherever that is possible. Thank you to TD bank group women entrepreneurs, further support of The Brand is Female.

You got it in you to succeed. Let TD help guide you. Visit The Brand is Female dot com slash podcast and click on the TD logo. Thank you for listening. I'll be back in a week with a new guest.